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 Post subject: Did 9:60 abrogate 7:199?
PostPosted: 23 Jan 2010, 03:52 
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As-Suyooti reports in his book, "Al-Itqaan fi `Uloom Al-Qur'aan" that the Zakah verse, 9:60, abrogated 7:199. Here are the two verses,

is claimed to have been abrogated by

Let's start the discussion by observing what the word العفو means. That is easy because it appears once more in

Therefore, it means the money to spare. Zakah has a minimum exemption specified by the Sunna, therefore it is taken only from the part of wealth which is in excess of what is needed for regular expenses and that is exactly the meaning of العفو. Thus, the teaching of the Prophet, peace be upon him, in regard to minimum networth for Zakah confirms, rather than abrogates 7:199.

Next, we notice that 7:199 defines what to take, while 9:60 defines whom to give to. Two different concerns, therefore no abrogation is warranted.

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 Post subject: Re: Did 9:60 abrogate 7:199?
PostPosted: 23 Jan 2010, 06:51 
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Conclusive argument.

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 Post subject: Who said what
PostPosted: 05 Jun 2010, 05:50 
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For:
Ibn Abbaas (according to Al-Khazraji and Ibn Al-Jawzi),
As-Suddi, Ad-Dhahhaak and Zayd (ibn Aslam?) (according to Shu`la),
Muqaatil,
Ibn Zayd, `Ataa',
Ibn Hazm Al-Andalusi,
Ibn Salaama, who said that its ending is abrogated by the sword verse.

Against:
Umar ibn Al-Khattaab (by his practice),
Abdullah and Urwa ibn Az-Zubayr as well as Ibn `Amr (who all said that خذ العفو means to be undemanding and magnanimous),
Mujaahid,
Al-Qaasim ibn Muhammad ibn Abi-Bakr,
Saalim ibn Abdillah,
Ad-Dhahhaak (implied),
Qataada,
At-Tabari,
Al-Qurtubi,
Ar-Raazi,
Ibn Al-Jawzi,
Ibn Al`Arabi,
An-Nahhaas,
Abu-Abdillah Shu`la,
As-Suyooti (implied by his exegesis, Al-Jalaalayn),
Dr. Mustafa Zayd,
Dr. Az-Zalmi,
Husaam Al-Ghaali.

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 Post subject: Re: Did 9:60 abrogate 7:199?
PostPosted: 06 Dec 2010, 17:21 
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Dr. Mustafa Zayd emphatically rejects this claim in his book النسخ في القرآن الكريم, volume 2, pages 224-228 (items 1057-1064) on the basis of no contradiction. He agrees with Ibn Az-Zubayr's interpretation that العفو means largess and quotes Qataada's interpretation confirming it, as reported in At-Tabari exegesis, volume 13, page 332.

عن ابن جرير الطبري قال: حدثنا بشر قال: حدثنا يزيد قال: حدثنا سعيد عن قتادة: قوله (خذ العفو وأمر بالعرف وأعرض عن الجاهلين)، قال: أخلاق أمر الله بها نبيه صلى الله عليه وسلم ودله عليها. اهـ

Translation: At-Tabari reported that Qataada said about 7:199 that it is manners God commanded His Prophet (PBUH) with and guided him to them.

Abu-Abdillah Shu`la, in his book صفوة الراسخ في علم المنسوخ والناسخ, page 141, agrees with that interpretation and says that the Prophet (PBUH) was a living confirmation of it.

As for Ibn Salaam's claim that the part that says, "Turn your side to the ignorant" was abrogated by the sword verse, Dr. Zayd agrees with the interpretation of An-Nahhaas that the ignorant may include fellow Muslims.

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 Post subject: Re: Did 9:60 abrogate 7:199?
PostPosted: 06 Aug 2013, 13:05 
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Al-Jabri agrees with the interpretation of العفو as largess, in his book لا نسخ في القرآن...لماذا؟, pages 121-122. He calls verse 7:199 جامعة مكارم الأخلاق (combiner of all noble manners). I know Ibn Hanbal called it something similar.

Al-Jabri also rejects that the epilogue of the verse was abrogated by the sword verse, because, he says, it refers to letting pass dumb talk. This may humble the ignorant, but if it doesn't, Al-Jabri says, then the sword will do the job.

I disagree with the last part. The sword is only used against physical attacks on Muslims and their allies. Dumb talk does not qualify.

Al-Jabri makes a good point about avoiding the ignorant. He says that not doing so is liable to lead us to do and say dumb things ourselves. Any reader of Internet comments can see that! Al-Jabri has a great description of dumb talkers: من لا حظ له من تنميق العبارة، وكان قاموسه اللغوي مجدب من الألفاظ الرقيقة الرفيقة (those who have no share in arrangement of statements and whose vocabulary is arid of soft, gentle words).

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 Post subject: Re: Did 9:60 abrogate 7:199?
PostPosted: 14 Aug 2013, 03:27 
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Linguistic wrote:
Al-Jabri has a great description of dumb talkers: من لا حظ له من تنميق العبارة، وكان قاموسه اللغوي مجدب من الألفاظ الرقيقة الرفيقة (those who have no share in arrangement of statements and whose vocabulary is arid of soft, gentle words).

I think "ignore the ignorant" is a pretty good advice to anyone even outside of religion. Not doing so is a futile exercise that wastes time and effort, and generates bad will both ways. Doing so gives the ignorant the only incentive to review their thoughts, since being ignored is a very potent medicine. You can't fight with someone who is ignoring you, but you sure can fight with someone who is debating you, and that may reenergize you and make you more stubborn about your view.

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