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 Post subject: Re: Did 9:5 abrogate 124 verses?
PostPosted: 22 Feb 2010, 08:08 
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Dr. Mostafa Zaid refutes 28 of the sword-verse claims under the "statement of fact" section on pages 413-417 in volume 1 of his book. He has a separate section on the sword verse, so I'll wait for that section to comment in detail.

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 Post subject: Re: Did 9:5 abrogate 124 verses?
PostPosted: 22 Feb 2010, 16:22 
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Ibn Al-Jawzi reports that Ibn Abbaas and Ad-Dhahhaak have said that

were abrogated by the sword verse. This is what he wrote,

ذكر الآية الرابعة: قوله تعالى "وإن عاقبتم فعاقبوا بمثل ما عوقبتم به ولئن صبرتم لهو خير للصابرين". للمفسرين في هذه الآية قولان:
الأول أنها نزلت قبل براءة فأمر رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم ان يقاتل من قاتله ولا يبدأ بالقتال ثم نسخ ذلك وأمر بالجهاد، قاله ابن عباس والضحاك. أخبرنا عبد الوهاب قال أبنا أبو الفضل بن خيرون وأبو طاهر الباقلاوي قالا أبنا أبو علي بن شاذان قال أبنا أحمد بن كامل قال حدثني محمد بن سعد قال حدثني عمي عن أبيه عن جده عن ابن عباس رضي الله عنهما "وإن عاقبتم فعاقبوا بمثل ما عوقبتم به"، فقال أمر الله تعالى نبيه صلى الله عليه وسلم أن يقاتل من قاتله ثم نزلت براءة فهذا من المنسوخ. فعلى هذا القول يكون المعنى ولئن صبرتم عن القتال ثم نسخ هذا بقوله "فاقتلوا المشركين حيث وجدتموهم".
والثاني أنها محكمة، وأنها نزلت فيمن ظلم ظلامة فلا يحل له أن ينال من ظالمه أكثر مما نال الظلم منه، قاله الشعبي والنخعي وابن سيرين والثوري. أخبرنا عبد الوهاب قال أبنا أبو طاهر قال أبنا ابن شاذان قال أبنا عبد الرحمن بن الحسن قال أبنا إبراهيم بن الحسين قال بنا آدم قال بنا ورقاء عن ابن أبي نجيح عن مجاهد "وإن عاقبتم فعاقبوا بمثل ما عوقبتم به" يقول لا تعتدوا يعني محمدا وأصحابه وعلى هذا القول يكون المعنى ولئن صبرتم على المثلة لا عن القتال هذا أصح من القول الأول.

ذكر الآية الخامسة: قوله تعالى "واصبر وما صبرك إلا بالله ولا تحزن عليهم"، هذه الآية متعلقة بالتي قبلها فحكمها، وقد زعم بعض المفسرين أن الصبر ها هنا منسوخ بآية السيف


He says that Ibn Abbaas has explicitly said that the sword verse allowed the Prophet to initiate fighting!

He quotes what Ash-Sha`bi, An-Nakh`i, Ibn Seereen and Ath-Thawri have said. They said this verse was not abrogated because its meaning is "do not transgress", not "do not fight." Ibn Al-Jawzi agrees.

Dr. Mustafa Zayd, in his book النسخ في القرآن الكريم, volume 2, pages 23-24 (item 725), cites a hadeeth where the Prophet (PBUH), on the day of his triumphant return to Mecca, announced amnesty for all polytheists except a few men he named. Then God revealed 16:126 and the Prophet (PBUH) said, "We endure and do not punish." Thus, he complied with the verse some scholars said was abrogated!

Who said what:
For:
Ibn Abbaas (implied),
Ibn Zayd (according to Al-Qurtubi),
Ibn Salaama, in his book الناسخ والمنسوخ في القرآن الكريم, page 79.

Against:
The majority (according to Al-Qurtubi),
Ash-Sha`bi, An-Nakh`i, Ibn Seereen and Ath-Thawri (according to Ibn Al-Jawzi),
Mujaahid (according to Ibn Al-Jawzi, wrote Dr. Zayd),
At-Tabari (quoted from his exegesis by Dr. Zayd),
Ibn Al-Jawzi,
Abu-Abdillah Shu`la,
Ibn Katheer (implied from his exegesis, quoted by Dr. Zayd),
Dr. Mustafa Zayd.

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 Post subject: Re: Did 9:5 abrogate 124 verses?
PostPosted: 22 Feb 2010, 16:52 
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This verse too,

was claimed by some to have been abrogated by the sword verse, Ibn Al-Jawzi writes,

ذكر الآية الثانية: قوله تعالى "وما أرسلناك عليهم وكيلا". للمفسرين في معنى الوكيل ثلاثة أقوال: الأول كفيلا تؤخذ بهم، قاله ابن عباس رضي الله عنهما. والثاني حافظا وربا قاله الفراء، والثالث كفيلا بهدايتهم وقادرا على إصلاح قلوبهم ذكره ابن الأنباري. وعلى هذا الآية محكمة. وقد زعم بعضهم أنها منسوخة بآية السيف وليس بصحيح وقد تكلمنا على نظائرها فيما سبق


He says he's explained what وكيل (manager or in charge) means before and the verse is not abrogated.

In his presentation of Abu-Abdillah Shu`la's book, صفوة الراسخ في علم المنسوخ والناسخ, Dr. M. Ibrahim Faaris, on page 136 in the footnotes, makes a very strange error! He says that Shu`la has incorrectly written the epilogue of this verse with و ما and he corrected him by writing it فما. But it is و ما! Shu`la is correct and Faaris is not. Faaris may have been thinking of
but that verse says حفيظا, not وكيلا. I hope he corrects this in an upcoming edition.

Who said what:
For:
Ibn Salaama.

Against:
Ibn Abbaas, Al-Farraa' and Ibn Al-Anbaari (implied by their different interpretations of the word وكيل),
Ibn Al-Jawzi,
Abu-Abdillah Shu`la,
Dr. Mustafa Zayd.

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 Post subject: Re: Did 9:5 abrogate 124 verses?
PostPosted: 23 Feb 2010, 17:14 
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Ibn Al-Jawzi has very harsh words for those who claimed that

was abrogated by the sword verse. He writes,

باب ذكر الآيات اللواتي ادعي عليهن النسخ في سورة مريم. ذكر الآية الأولى: قوله تعالى "وأنذرهم يوم الحسرة". زعم بعض المغفلين من ناقلي التفسير أن الإنذار منسوخ بآية السيف، وهذا تلاعب من هؤلاء بالقرآن. ومن أين يقع التنافي بين إنذارهم القيامة وبين قتالهم في الدنيا


He says that there is no contradiction between warning disbelievers of the Day of Judgment and fighting them in this world. Of course there isn't.

He uses harsh words in dismissing this claim: he described the claimants as simpletons and the claim as playing tricks with the Quran!

Who said what:
For:
Ibn Salaama, in his book الناسخ والمنسوخ في القرآن الكريم, page 82.

Against:
At-Tabari and Ibn Katheer (implied, says Dr. Zayd),
Ibn Al-Jawzi,
Dr. Mustafa Zayd.

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 Post subject: Re: Did 9:5 abrogate 124 verses?
PostPosted: 23 Feb 2010, 17:28 
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Linguistic wrote:
زعم بعض المغفلين من ناقلي التفسير

I wonder who he is talking about. Maybe Zaid will give more detail when I get to that part.

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 Post subject: Re: Did 9:5 abrogate 124 verses?
PostPosted: 23 Feb 2010, 17:43 
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Ibn Al-Jawzi reports, with harsh words, that

was claimed abrogated by the sword verse. He wrote,

ذكر الآية الرابعة: قوله تعالى "قل من كان في الضلالة فليمدد له الرحمن مدا". وزعم ذلك الجاهل أنها منسوخة بآية السيف وهذا باطل. قال الزجاج هذه الآية لفظها لفظ أمر، ومعناها الخبر. والمعنى إن الله تعالى جعل جزاء ضلالته أن يتركه فيها. وعلى هذا لا وجه للنسخ


He says that Az-Zajjaaj explained that the style of this verse is declarative in the format of an imperative and that it means: God made the punishment for a disbeliever's misguidance is to leave him in it! I like that a lot.

Another meaning I got from the verse is that God may even supply a disbeliever with goods to the point that he thinks he is on the right path and others start to wonder if he is. This meaning is confirmed elsewhere, such as,

And


Al-Khazraji, in his book نفس الصباح في غريب القرآن وناسخه ومنسوخه, volume 2, page 485, reports that Ibn Al-`Arabi has stated that the consensus has been that a supplication can only be abrogated by another supplication.

Who said what:
For:
Ibn Hazm Al-Andalusi,
Ibn Salaama,
Al-Karmi (according to Dr. Zayd).

Against:
Az-Zajjaaj,
Ibn Al-Jawzi,
Ibn Al`Arabi,
Dr. Mustafa Zayd.

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 Post subject: Re: Did 9:5 abrogate 124 verses?
PostPosted: 23 Feb 2010, 17:49 
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Linguistic wrote:
Another meaning I got from the verse is that God may even supply a disbeliever with goods to the point that he thinks he is on the right path and others start to wonder if he is. This meaning is confirmed elsewhere, such as
7:182-183 and 68:44

This is a crucial notion. It has another benefit, which is to reassure the believers who are tested in this life that being tested by no means implies that they are bad, since vice versa doesn't hold either.

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 Post subject: Re: Did 9:5 abrogate 124 verses?
PostPosted: 23 Feb 2010, 17:53 
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One more verse in Chapter 19 claimed abrogated by the sword verse is


Ibn Al-Jawzi reports this claim, with harsh words, as follows,

ذكر الآية الخامسة: قوله تعالى "فلا تعجل عليهم إنما نعد لهم عدا". زعم بعض المفسرين أنها منسوخة بآية السيف، وهذا ليس بصحيح، لأنه إن كان المعنى لا تعجل بطلب عذابهم الذي يكون في الآخرة، فإن المعنى أن أعمارهم سريعة الفناء فلا وجه للنسخ. وإن كان المعنى لا تعجل بطلب قتالهم فإن هذا السورة نزلت بمكة ولم يؤمر حينئذ بالطلب فنهيه عن الاستعجال بطلب قتالهم واقع في موضعه، ثم أمره بقتالهم بعد الهجرة لا ينافي النهي عن طلب القتال بمكة، فكيف يتوجه النسخ؟ فسبحان من قدر وجود قوم جهال يتلاعبون بالكلام في القرآن يدعون نسخ ما ليس بمنسوخ! وكان ذلك من سوء الفهم نعوذ بالله منه


He says that the meaning of this verse is one of two things:
  1. "Do not hasten that they be punished because that will happen in the Hereafter", in which case the verse assures the Prophet (PBUH) that their ages are short, or
  2. "Do not hasten fighting them", which would be incorrect since this verse was revealed in Mecca before the order to fight was given.

I agree.

He adds that some have played an abrogation game without knowledge and claimed verses abrogated which are not.

Who said what:
For:
Some exegetes (according to Ibn Al-Jawzi),
Ibn Hazm Al-Andalusi,
Ibn Salaama,
An-Naasir (according to Dr. Al-Husayni),
Al-Khazraji.

Against:
Ibn Al`Arabi,
Ibn Al-Jawzi,
Aş-Şa`di,
Dr. Mustafa Zayd.

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 Post subject: Re: Did 9:5 abrogate 124 verses?
PostPosted: 23 Feb 2010, 18:09 
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Linguistic wrote:
فسبحان من قدر وجود قوم جهال يتلاعبون بالكلام في القرآن يدعون نسخ ما ليس بمنسوخ! وكان ذلك من سوء الفهم نعوذ بالله منه

Hear, hear.

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 Post subject: Re: Did 9:5 abrogate 124 verses?
PostPosted: 23 Feb 2010, 19:00 
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Ibn Al-Jawzi reports that two verses in Chapter 20 were claimed abrogated by the sword verse. They are,

and


Here is what he wrote about that,

باب ذكر الآيات اللواتي ادعي عليهن النسخ في سورة طه. ذكر الآية الأولى: قوله تعالى "فاصبر على ما يقولون". قال جماعة من المفسرين معناها فاصبر على ما تسمع من أذاهم ثم نسخت بآية السيف.

ذكر الآية الثانية: قوله تعالى "قل كل متربص فتربصوا"، قالوا هي منسوخة بآية السيف. وقد ذكروا في سورة الأنبياء ما لا يحسن ذكره مما ادعوا فيه النسخ فأضربنا عنه


He also mentions that there have been verses in Chapter 21 claimed abrogated but that it was so improper that he would not even address it!

As for 20:135, does it not say, "Keep watch and you will know"? How then does an order to fight abrogate that?

Who said what:
For:
Some exegetes (according to Ibn Al-Jawzi),
Ibn Hazm Al-Andalusi,
Ibn Salaama,
Al-Khazraji.

Against:
Ibn Al-Jawzi (20:135),
Abu-Abdillah Shu`la,
Dr. Mustafa Zayd.

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