TheMostReadBook.org

An English translation of the Quran that is as close as possible to the Arabic sacred text
View active topics
  Verse(s):    
View unanswered posts





Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 7 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: Verses 13:10-11
PostPosted: 06 Jun 2009, 04:38 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: 08 May 2009, 14:16
Posts: 1994
Go to previous segment   Go to next segment


Suggested translation1,2:


-------
1This translation may have been updated from the original suggested translation as a result of the discussions that follow.
2Click on the {verse number} of a translation to see other good translations of the verse.

Go to previous segment   Go to next segment


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Verses 13:10-11
PostPosted: 06 Aug 2009, 22:51 
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: 04 May 2009, 16:10
Posts: 4534
Location: USA
Quote:
{13:10} It is the same [to Him] concerning you whether one conceals [his] speech or one publicizes it and whether one is hidden by night or conspicuous [among others] by day.

Only Sarwar caught the meaning of مستخف as he translated it "try to hide." Literally, it means one who seeks to be hidden.

I also noticed a very erroneous translation, IMHO, by Asad when he translated أسر القول as "conceal his thought."

I'd suggest this,
{13:10} It is the same [to God] concerning you whether one says something in private or in public and whether one tries to hide by night or be conspicuous by day.

_________________
A candle loses nothing by lighting another candle.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Verses 13:10-11
PostPosted: 12 Aug 2009, 03:21 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: 05 May 2009, 00:16
Posts: 1838
Location: USA
Linguistic wrote:
I'd suggest this,
{13:10} It is the same [to God] concerning you whether one says something in private or in public and whether one tries to hide by night or be conspicuous by day.

I think it should be "It is the same among you who ..."

_________________
To translate is the best way to understand


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Verses 13:10-11
PostPosted: 12 Aug 2009, 06:45 
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: 04 May 2009, 16:10
Posts: 4534
Location: USA
Pragmatic wrote:
Linguistic wrote:
I'd suggest this,
{13:10} It is the same [to God] concerning you whether one says something in private or in public and whether one tries to hide by night or be conspicuous by day.

I think it should be "It is the same among you who ..."

This is one example of how different Arabic and English are in their linguistic constructs. The Arabic literally says, "It is the same among you who makes secret a speech or announces it" but that would be almost cryptic to the English reader. In English one would express this principle by saying, "There is no difference between one who says something in private or in public."

How about,
{13:10} It is the same [to God] whether one of you says something in private or in public, and whether one tries to hide by night or be conspicuous by day.

_________________
A candle loses nothing by lighting another candle.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Verses 13:10-11
PostPosted: 12 Aug 2009, 15:06 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: 05 May 2009, 00:16
Posts: 1838
Location: USA
What I was trying to do was to make "same" describe the persons rather than their deeds, since this is the way it is expressed in Arabic. Perhaps a different order of the words is needed in English to convey that meaning without sounding funny. Something like

{13:10} Those among you who say something in private or in public are the same [to God], and so are those who try to hide by night or be conspicuous by day.

_________________
To translate is the best way to understand


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Verses 13:10-11
PostPosted: 12 Aug 2009, 19:31 
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: 04 May 2009, 16:10
Posts: 4534
Location: USA
Pragmatic wrote:
What I was trying to do was to make "same" describe the persons rather than their deeds, since this is the way it is expressed in Arabic. Perhaps a different order of the words is needed in English to convey that meaning without sounding funny. Something like

{13:10} Those among you who say something in private or in public are the same [to God], and so are those who try to hide by night or be conspicuous by day.

Interesting angle. Your suggested translation would be very good if the sameness is meant for the people and not their actions. Honestly, I don't see that it's the people who are meant by the verse. The principle stated in the verse is that people cannot hope to escape the consequences of what they say by saying it in private, neither can they escape the consequences of their actions by trying to hide under the cover of night. God sees and hears them anyway.

If you agree that the verse means that, then we need to convey that meaning in English while remaining as close as possible to the Arabic words and sentence structure.

_________________
A candle loses nothing by lighting another candle.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Verses 13:10-11
PostPosted: 13 Aug 2009, 02:49 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: 05 May 2009, 00:16
Posts: 1838
Location: USA
Linguistic wrote:
Your suggested translation would be very good if the sameness is meant for the people and not their actions. Honestly, I don't see that it's the people who are meant by the verse.

The reason I concluded it was a description of the people, no their action, is the use of mann (who) rather than ma (what) after the opening "Equal/same among you."

_________________
To translate is the best way to understand


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 7 posts ] 


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron
It is currently 17 Jan 2021, 14:57

All times are UTC

Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group