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 Post subject: Did a hadeeth abrogate 12:101?
PostPosted: 18 Aug 2010, 13:20 
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Al-Khazraji, in his book نفس الصباح في غريب القرآن وناسخه ومنسوخه, volume 1, pages 425-426, states that

was abrogated by the hadeeth of the Prophet (PBUH) in which he says, "Let not one of you wish for death because of a harm that descended on him." Narrated by Anas ibn Maalik, reported by Al-Bukhaari, Muslim and Ibn Maajah and rated authentic.

An-Nahhaas called this claim "meaningless, and if it weren't that we wanted our book to be comprehensive, we would not have mentioned it." He said that Joseph, peace be upon him, did not wish for death; he wished that he would be Muslim when he dies. That, of course, is what it is.

Makki also rejected the claim as a declarative statement. I don't see that.

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 Post subject: Who said what
PostPosted: 18 Aug 2010, 13:23 
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For:
Al-Khazraji.

Against:
An-Nahhaas,
Makki,
Ibn Salaama (he did not address this claim; he only stated that there are no abrogated or abrogating verses in Chapter 12),
Aş-Şa`di (who said the entire Chapter 12 is Muhkam),
Abdullah ibn Al-Mutahhar (who said the entire Chapter 12 is Muhkam, per Dr. Al-Husayni),
Dr. Mustafa Zayd.

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 Post subject: Re: Did a hadeeth abrogate 12:101?
PostPosted: 19 Aug 2010, 05:33 
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Linguistic wrote:
Makki also rejected the claim as a declarative statement. I don't see that.

First, let me say that this claim brings the level of scholarship here to a new low. As for being a declarative statement, I think he means that this is a narration of a story. The imperative form used is something that Joseph (PBUH) said, not a command from God that may be subject to abrogation.

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 Post subject: Re: Did a hadeeth abrogate 12:101?
PostPosted: 19 Aug 2010, 06:27 
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Pragmatic wrote:
As for being a declarative statement, I think he means that this is a narration of a story. The imperative form used is something that Joseph (PBUH) said, not a command from God that may be subject to abrogation.

But stories in the Quran are not there for entertainment; they are to teach us values and laws. Jurists have disagreed whether the laws of prior nations are laws for us too. Many scholars believe they are.

I agree to a point: We don't know what the laws of prior nations are! Because their scriptures have been edited by them. So, the only laws of prior nations that we can be certain were from God are the laws that God tells us about in the Quran. It is therefore incumbent upon Muslims to follow all the laws stated in the Quran, even if they were presented within stories of prior nations.

With that in mind, verse 12:101 was thought by those who saw in it a case of abrogation an approval of praying for death! If such was an approved value in prior nations, then it is for us too, since God tells us about it in the Quran. But since the hadeeth forbids praying for death, those scholars jumped to the abrogation explanation.

Their understanding is mistaken, IMHO, as I discussed in the OP.

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 Post subject: Re: Did a hadeeth abrogate 12:101?
PostPosted: 08 Dec 2010, 17:38 
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Dr. Mustafa Zayd rejects this claim in his book النسخ في القرآن الكريم, volume 2, pages 241-242 (items 1098-1100) on the basis of no contradiction, besides the fact that the Sunna cannot abrogate a verse. There is no contradiction, he asserts, because the hadeeth specifies the cause that it warns against that would prompt someone to wish for death. That cause being a harm that befell him. That does not mean that one may not wish for death for other causes.

To prove that point, Dr. Zayd quotes a narration where Umar ibn Al-Khattaab, may God have been pleased with him, after having expanded Muslim territory and Islam reigned supreme, he called upon God saying, "O God, I've become old, my bones are thin, my subjects are all over, seize me to You if I'm neither excessive nor neglectful." I can see that. Umar figured that if there was ever a good time for him to die it was then!

Dr. Zayd also quotes a hadeeth, reported by Maalik and narrated by Abu-Hurayra, in which the Prophet (PBUH) said, "Whoever loves the meeting with God, God loves to meet him, and whoever hates the meeting with God, God hates to meet him."

All that being said, I don't think that Joseph's prayer was a death wish. It only meant that he wants to be Muslim when he dies.

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