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 Post subject: Re: Which Verses?
PostPosted: 09 Sep 2010, 05:41 
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On pages 50-51of this book, the author reports the results of his research about which verses the pro-abrogation scholars all agreed were abrogated, stating the he did not find a single verse where there was unanimity. He further asserts that a scholar who was unable to understand 100 verses, said 100 verses were abrogated; another who was unable to understand 10, said 10 were abrogated; etc.

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 Post subject: Re: Which Verses?
PostPosted: 13 Sep 2010, 08:14 
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On page 74 of this book, the author counts the verses that Zaid discussed in his book. Among them, the author mentions that Zaid refuted 6 verses that were almost unanimously agreed upon before as abrogated, and sometimes used as examples of proving that there is abrogation in the Quran. I need to look up which verses these are.

The author also quotes Al-Jabri saying that Zaid ignored Al-Jabri's book although Zaid had a copy of it before he started writing his thesis.

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 Post subject: Re: Which Verses?
PostPosted: 28 Sep 2010, 18:18 
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Linguistic wrote:
8. The fasting allowance verse, 2:184.
9. The "accounting of thoughts" verse, 2:284.
10. The "true piety" verse, 3:102.
11. The "marriage to fornicators" verse, 24:3.

Haani Taahir, in his book تنزيه آي القرآن عن النسخ والنقصان, pages 163-164, confirms the above additions, except the "accounting of thoughts" verse (2:284) and the "true piety" verse (3:102). And he says that Az-Zurqaani counted 4:16 as an additional claim he approves of. I wonder how can reporters differ so much about a published book!

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 Post subject: Re: Which Verses?
PostPosted: 28 Sep 2010, 18:25 
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According to Haani Taahir, author of تنزيه آي القرآن عن النسخ والنقصان, pages 161-163, states that Dr. Hilmi Abdul-Haadi has discussed 75 abrogation claims made by Abdul-Qaahir Al-Baghdaadi and refuted all but seven:

4:11-12/2:180
2:234/2:240
24:2/4:15
24:2/4:16
8:66/8:65
58:13/58:12
72:20/73:2

Taahir says that he agrees with most of Abdul-Haadi's conclusions of what the law is regarding those verses, but not because of abrogation; rather because of proper interpretation of the verses! See the individual topics for Taahir's view. He wonders why Abdul-Haadi included the first two above (2:180 and 2:240) even though he read Dr. Zayd's book in which he clearly refuted their abrogation.

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 Post subject: Re: Which Verses?
PostPosted: 28 Sep 2010, 18:28 
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Linguistic wrote:

There is a reason why we called them the big 3. :)

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 Post subject: Re: Which Verses?
PostPosted: 07 Oct 2010, 06:54 
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Az-Zamakhshari, in his exegesis,
الكشاف، أبو القاسم الزمخشري، مطبعة مصطفى البابي الحلبي وأولاده، ١٩٦٦م

never once mentioned about any verse that a consensus of scholars have agreed that it was abrogated! Haani Taahir noticed that and reports it in his book تنزيه آي القرآن عن النسخ والنقصان, page 66.

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 Post subject: Re: Which Verses?
PostPosted: 15 Oct 2011, 16:43 
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Pragmatic wrote:
Zero Consensus

Dr. Husayn Nassaar, in his book الناسخ والمنسوخ في القرآن الكريم, page 29, talks about claimed consensus. He says that many scholars have claimed consensus on abrogation, but later hedged by naming "a few who opposed it." Dr. Nassaar says that it would be more accurate to say that there was a majority of pro-abrogation scholars in ancient times and that majority came loose afterwards.

I'm sure there will always be pro-abrogation folk out there, out of loyalty to predecessors. However, I'm hopeful that a new majority of anti-abrogation forms up, as is becoming more evident from recent publications by Muslim scholars.

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 Post subject: Re: Which Verses?
PostPosted: 15 Oct 2011, 18:04 
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Linguistic wrote:
He says that many scholars have claimed consensus on abrogation, but later hedged by naming "a few who opposed it." Dr. Nassaar says that it would be more accurate to say that there was a majority of pro-abrogation scholars in ancient times and that majority came loose afterwards.

Good way of putting it when we challenge the claim of consensus.

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